The Spice smoking mixture range has been one of the most popular “herbal” smokes ever, and now it’s no suprise why.
To get an idea of just how popular these mixtures are, just take a look at this data from Google’s keyword tool:
That’s over 37,000 searches a month for these three search terms alone — Spice is definitely a customer favourite. I also get no less than 500 emails a day from Russia asking if I can ship it there by the kilo. So what’s behind it all?
This paper [PDF; 246 kB] has some interesting things to say. It turns out that the Spice blends all contain JWH-018 as well as two compounds based on CP 47497 — all of them synthetic cannabinoids. These are man made chemicals designed to tickle the same receptors as THC, the active compound in cannabis, so it’s no wonder these smoking mixtures are so powerful. The difference in potency between the Spice blends appears to be accounted for by increasing levels of these CP 47497 homologues.
Since this discovery, Spice has been banned in several countries, including Austria and Germany. The BBC also reported on it and had the following to say:
The UK drugs regulator, the Medicine and Healthcare products Regulatory Agency (MHRA), is understood to have identified JWH018 in products available in the UK. It is currently in order to determine whether or not it should be classified as a medicinal product — which would mean it should only be available from a doctor.
The UK Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs, which advises the government on whether a drug should be made illegal, is also aware of the substance, and is investigating it.
The Spice manufacturers make no mention of these synthetics on their packaging, so a lot of herb-enthusiasts feel somewhat betrayed. Rightly so, I suppose — not being told just what you’re smoking exactly. People have the choice to put things in their body and some Spice smokers might make a different decision if they had all the facts in hand.
But, why?
The typical reaction to this news seems to be the disgust about putting any of these “unsafe” man-made compounds into their body, as though mother nature was some kind of safety net. “These plants have thousands of years of safe use”, they say! But let’s take a closer look…
Take Kratom, for instance. Kratom contains a powerful compound called mitragynine, which acts upon the opioid receptors; the same targets for opium and its derivatives. One alkaloid in kratom, although present in much smaller quantities, is 7-hydroxymitragynine, which is apparently 17x more potent than morphine! While I wouldn’t call this plant harmful, compared to other drugs like cocaine and heroin, it wouldn’t say it was harmless either. The opioid receptors are a dangerous set of receptors to be messing with — the mu subtype responsible for the classic euphoria that accompanies opiate use also stops you breathing if you tickle them too much. Opiates are also addictive, just like kratom can be if you take too much. While this plant may have seen thousands of years of responsible, moderate use, this is no reassurance at all towards its safety.
Now days, people generally don’t toil in the field every day that Newton sends — we have more free time and money to spend than ever before. We can now afford to use large quantities of kratom every day, as well as other entheogens from around the world, but we don’t have any information about this level of exposure to kratom itself or in combination with other stuff. For all we know, taking a mixture of kratom and Salvia divinorum daily could make your eyeballs explode after day 300, or chronic kratom use might give you some kind of evil superpower. Looking at paracetamol as a rather boring example, if you take the odd one every now and then, you’ll be fine, but if you take 8 pills a day every day for a year, you’ll likely end up with some serious condition. There’s also the fact that modern chemistry can create powerful extracts of these entheogens. Who’s to say they’re safe, just because they come from a plant? And what about any other drugs we might be on? Being on a selective serotonin reuptake inhibitor like Prozac for depression isn’t uncommon in today’s society — combine them with the “perfectly safe” Banisteriopsis caapi vine, itself a monoamine oxidase inhibitor, and you have a potentially fatal combination of drugs in your system. I bet there are many more contraindications we haven’t even considered.
What about plants like cannabis and tobacco? They’ve also been used responsibly for thousands of years, but it’s only when so many people start to take these things that we realised “Actually, smoking is bad for us”. Besides, our current medical knowledge means we’ve only recently been able to diagnose these kind of things. I’m not sure I want to trust any data from a period when epilepsy might have been down to a demonic possession. How many adverse health effects could we identify in these ancient entheogen users based on what we know today?
So, while we can be uncertain of the long term effects on health of JWH-018 and friends, it seems we can’t actually be certain about the safety of most of the things we happily consume. Yes, they may turn out to be super toxic (although probably not, if they’re given to lab rats), but at least they only act on your cannabinoid receptors. Kratom tends to be prepared as a tea — once you’ve drunk it, you’ve drunk it. If you’ve taken too much, you’ll realise when its already in your blood. It would be much harder to overdose on these synthetics due to the speed at which they get in your system — if you’re too stoned, you won’t want to smoke any more, never mind being physically able to. The cannabinoid receptors they target are also much safter than the opioid targets of kratom. Cannabinoid receptors seem play a modulatory role, rather than being majorly important, so messing with them doesn’t have as drastic an effect. Smoking too much might make you feel a bit sick and dizzy for a while, but you certainly won’t stop breathing.
In all, I think Spice is in the wrong for not making this clear in the first place, but then I’m not suprised they didn’t want to list these compounds in the current political climate. Maybe when the government realises that it is our right to put things into our own bodies, listing these ingredients wouldn’t be an issue.
Even with this new information however, I’ll still be using the stuff. It’s great!
Here’s another story about a miserable experience on an “herbal incense” blend. I am female, 5’9, 150 lbs. I have smoked plenty of pot and I tried a different blend once before, “Swerve”, and found it wonderful. I wanted to have a good time with my friend so we bought a blend called “Bayou Blaster” as recommended by the people behind the counter and behind us in line.
We smoked out of a pipe in a park and felt nothing for a few minutes and then all of a sudden it hit me so hard.. I had never been that high in my life. Everything was incredibly distorted and my heart started pounding, so hard and so fast. I started to worry that something was seriously wrong. I tried to feel my pulse but was not exactly sure just how hard it was really beating, but what I felt (or imagined) must have put me up to 250 bpm. I literally thought my heart was going to explode. I’ve never felt so terrified.
I slowly got more high. We kept looking for a bench to sit down on and every time we’d find one it would just disappear. It turned into what felt like a 3 hour long panic attack. I couldn’t stop shaking and I ended up throwing up after trying to drink some water and eat crackers. I seriously considered calling an ambulance as I was sure I was going to die. Everything was moving and I really just wanted it to stop. I fell asleep and woke up a few hours later glad to be sober and alive.
The next day, I’m not still high or anything but I’m still having minor chest pains. I’m considering having an EKG done.
All in all, I think that smoking these blends is a horrible idea. The packages don’t even tell you which chemicals are in them, on top of them barely even being researched.
Wow. A full blown soap opera! LOL. Getting high.
Not getting high vs getting high. Legal vs Illegal. Naturals vs Synthetics. Slaps on the hand vs no slaps on the hands. I can drink all night and live a normal life vs I can’t handle drinking all night and live a normal life.
The “people” vs “the government”.
Damn, I had a bad trip vs Damn, I had a good trip. I need a crutch vs I don’ t need a crutch. Paranoia vs Non-Paranoia. Panic attacks vs no panic attacks. I self medicate vs I don’t self medicate.
I have just finished reading through all the posts to this blog about “JWH-018″.
This is what happens when people have forgotten that they have a responsibility to “know thyself” and be accountable. Oops. Sorry it sounds like I am preaching to the choir.
But all in all this has been a very successful blog. It has exposed “our humanity” and what is “socially acceptable” or “socially unacceptable”!
Everyday we face a “battlefield of thoughts” that are relentless and will remain that way.
Now as I have read the last post I saw the word “compassion” it has occured to me that this is what has been lost.
I pray we can all return to this compassion to defeat the never ending need to fight and be right or to fight and destroy.
There is “no fear” in love. Easily said, but not so easily lived.
Thank you for a place to share my thoughts and to sit and hope that in the end we can “learn” compassion.
Now I am going get my bong and enjoy some bliss.
i see that everyone here blames the JWH-018 and fails to think about the actual herbs you are smoking. Ive done some research on some of these brands and they have herbs in it known to cause severe side effects in some people. not to mention that anything coming in a vacuum sealed package is being shipped from over seas and you dont know whats in it. i use black mamba and mr spicy green and as long as you dont treat it like weed and try to puff a whole bunch ive had no issues what so ever. i got so ripped i could barely walk but i didnt have a panic attack. its a drug be prepared. you need to understand this stuff is 100x stronger than THC. what do you think is gonna happen when you are not responsible? in low dosages its a wonderful experience. use sparingly and think before you delve into a new thing. buy from the black mamba family its the best out there and it never has anything but the JWH-018 and the herbs listed. none of which are harmful. unless of course you have allergies.
I am looking for recipes. Take how many mg of Jwh-018 and what liquid do I add it to and how much herb do I need to apply it to? Thank You,
Scott
Here is a link to a forum that has different variations of spice recipes.
http://www.rollitup.org/hallucinatory-substances/173480-make-your-own-spice.html
My user name on there is Skinnbonez37 and you can see the exact recipe I used to make 50 grams of spice. I just finished selling and smoking all my first batch which lasted me about a month, and I’ve been smoking other blends for over two months and still no “tweak out’s” or “panic attacks”.
To everyone else out there smoking this stuff and getting panic attacks I’m starting to wonder if we are smoking the same stuff. I know many people in my town that have smoked plenty of this stuff and none of them have had any panic attacks which leads me to believe there may be some bad batches floating around of Spice. Which might have other things mixed in with them causing these episodes for people. What do I know though that’s just IMO.
Can we just have some COMPASSION for a few bad apples in the barrel.
I would definitely say you have to smoke this stuff in moderation, I smoked about 2 bowl fulls of Vision and I felt lyk I honestly was going to die..increases heart rate, I could hear my head thumping lyk crazy..I literally just laid and prayed I wouldn’t die and just calmed myself down. I smoked 2 bowls of spice gold and got stoned out of my mind..it was a less intense high but it felt very heavy on my chest headaches, dizziness, and it lasted clear into the next day.. Honestly, this shyt has nothing on weed..not even close. Definitely do some research and don’t approach thi lyk weed or be in for a Bad Trip..take it r leave it. Peace
This is really starting to sound like there are just some blends out there that are either too strong, or mixed with other things causing these problems. So not all spice mixtures are bad…but some have the potential to be I guess? Like E$ said…don’t approach it like weed if it’s your first time..because it’s not weed..
@idiot
it’s funny that you mention Bayou Blaster I toked that shyt and one bad episode(cleared 3 bowls) So I can definitely relate…I hit it too hard and I thought I wouldn’t make it..lol
Out of four of my friends I was the only one who tripped out, my other brhs hit that shyt non stop – so I guess it all depends, weird tho cuz I’m about 6’3 190 they are all avg 5’8 175ish..i can handle weed & brew very well but that shyt took me to my knees haha so yea “Toker beware”..
I’m wondering if anyone has ever died from this?? Either way..it’s not worth it, stick too low hashes of spice, fuk that off– brand shyt
@ the EOD is at all really worth it?
Very interested in hearing of individuals recovery from these spice blends.
someone who isn’t me purchased Spike99 Ultra and Mojo, had smoked very little amounts of each. (About 2 hits each session) over 4 sessions each spaced out between different weeks everything was fine and the product seemed to be nice.
On the 5th session (6 days ago) after again only 2 hits, things went very bad. Strong tremors developed through the body and would come in waves, heart rate seemed extremely strong and fast, mind racing in many directions. A feeling of possible death was present. This experience lasted about 1.5 hours.
The week following this event has been difficult for this individual. There has been a constant sense of being off balance and light headed. A sense of overall not-well being has accompanied these symptoms and something resembling panic attacks have been taking place. Trying to calm down is very difficult at times. Vision is mostly normal with slight shaking. Individual notices concentrating is more difficult. Slight nausea is also felt at times.
This individual is hoping these symptoms go away and that life will again be ‘normal’. This individual hopes he will come out of this horrible ordeal.
The past 6 days have been very scary.
If there are others that have experienced this and have had these symptoms fade away. Please post.
Hi
You will be fine. It was good that this has happened to you; you are now more aware. You will get better over time. This stuff is way more stronger than THC. You mind is in shock. Some individuals get like this after weed; after a bad trip. The feelings you are experiencing are normal. I spoke to a friend recently who counsels people with addictions and he told me he meets people all the time who have had very bad episodes with the head stores here in Ireland. One patient described the feeling as something akin to shell shock, that’s the way he felt. He felt like he had just walked out of a building were a bomb had just gone of. I know it sounds a bit funny; but it’s true. Don’t touch this stuff again; if you don’t learn from this you are a fool. That’s the body telling you that what you have put into your body is very bad indeed. Don’t mind the other idiots who take the stuff. We are all different; in other words you don’t really know what this stuff could do to you. And keep away from weed and hash(all drugs). Imagine being stuck with side effects for the rest of your life. For example HPPD(look it up). That’s it my friend, never, I repeat never put that shit into your system again. Your life starts from today. And don’t look back. Speak to a good counselor if you fell very bad, someone who has been in the dark, so to speak. He will help you. Just ask. This to shall pass
Good luck.
Garret
It could take a year to recover.
Don’t smoke hash or weed. It will not be a nice experience, trust me, you will swing right off reality into a shit hole again.
Lol there is nothing wrong with weed and hash or else there wouldn’t be hundred’s of thousand’s of marijuana users. Weed is fine…how many cases are there where some one has OD’d on weed?? How many deaths were caused by smoking weed?
i think he is reffering to the Soaked Receptors that may provide a Flash Back to that bad trip if agitated by weed or hash, i HAVE done too much jwh (22mg) and also my mind told me i was starting to die, the stress became unbearable as i thought of my two children, my wife, my mom, my dogs…it was BAD BUT i kept myself rational that its ok , Panicking will make it WORSE (true in my case) and I felt like I needed Water, im talking like my mind was saying drink water and you will not die! I did drink and felt much better within 10 min. Its weird that our minds can ‘tell’ us things. I know my mind was saying, too much too quick and now im dehydrating! I stopped jwh for a week, smoked a J and had similar experience to the bad trip. after that ive switched to 73 and i have no more freak outs or issues!
Buyer Beware! 18 is active between 1mg-3mg if its Good Quality! I bought from a research chemical place and it took 14mg to get any feeling ( waiting 30 min betwwen dose to make sure) so i got used to that ratio , so when i got my hands on GOOD stuff i thought i would be care ful and only try 10mg (half of my previously succesful trial) and i felt the ‘fear’ so i know that in the future i will ALWAYS start with one mg and work way up slowly.… Cut, Weak suppliers are DANGEROUS! people think that a 15mg-25mg dose is safe after using a impure/cut product and they get used to such a high ratio when they do get good stuff or reach an uncut spot of there baggie they are in for a fright!
hey synchronium can you delete my last post 165 in retrospect i shouldn’t have posted so much , i will repost about the dangers of getting used to stepped on product minus the other details
Our minds tell us we’re going to die because we are going to die. The JWH makes it more obvious to us, it hits home harder when you trip on JWH. You might not die today but you will die; it is unavoidable and impossible. I also think of death from time to time while tripping on JWH or other hallucinagens; and it is frightening but it also just reality.
You fear death because you fear life. Give up the drugs and face reality would you. Notice what this stuff is going to your brain.
http://www.moillusions.com/2008/11/3d-chalk-drawings-update.html
That is a trippy thing, feeling like i am dieing,not ‘realizing its inevitable…i know that..i just kept thinking shit…what have i done…i feel like im spinning into a different reality in and out…need water…need cold water…solution to pollution is dilution… kept repeating that because I’ve learned it in a survival training course
About all my post…I am totally making it all up, i am a researcher who is studying the sub culture to write my book on the problems of marijuana prohibition and the economic solution that lies in Total decriminalization and legalization! I DO NOT smoke pot or anything else but kools . I do have friends and family who smoke because of ms, cancer and what not.
It is a miracle to see how it changed their lives from misery and not being able to function independently due to pain to total freedom and enlightenment and they got their appetite back! which means no more stomach tube feedings!
I am in the navy and found out about the legal smoking blends before they became main stream and all. Having being a person who enjoyed smoking weed i quickly fell in love with the ability to get stoned everyday without worrying about a drug test. Now as i believe i am a reasonably intelligent person i made a choice to not over do it with this stuff and chose to only do it periodically, mostly on a social basis and i have to say i have had nothing bad to say about my usage until last night and i feel it is the result of long term use or perhaps i used a blend that was way too strong for a therapeutic dose.
having said that, what ensues now is a detailed flashback of the WORST thing i have ever experienced in my life…
As similar with some people i smoked last night as to relax myself and prepare for bed. i smoked a normal bowl sized amount of happy shaman herbs specifically the humboldt gold. i finished the last hit and i quickly came under the influence and as minutes passed the buzz intensified unlike it has ever done before. now i like the different mind set that most experience along with the depersonalization and dissocialization that people speak of, however as the symptoms worsened the buzz transitioned from a psychological effect to a deathly terrifying physiological effect. i layed myself down on the bed and being in the medical field i took note of these negative effects.
from this experience i noticed my heart was racing and i was having some chest pains which radiated down my left arm. the other most noted sensation was a feeling similar to feeling like my brain was moving inside my head most notably in the center of my head. the sensation was not painful but i felt like my head was being split from the inside out and it would wash over me in waves. alot of people speak of an aura right before having a seizure and i think i was experiencing something like that. i felt like i had to make a conscious effort to hold myself together and not DIE. also i felt like the waves would start in my spine and would sort of float up through my head giving me the sensation my brain was splitting from the inside out. Honestly i felt like i was dying so i started walking to try to keep from losing control as i spoke of earlier and gradually the symptoms subsided and i went back to bed.
today i woke feeling normal for the most part but i still feel like there are some residuals of last night still active but being young i dont feel it is a threat.
hopefully my experience will help someone or open others to the fact that just like most things this stuff catches up with you. it is my personal choice to never use this stuff again because i seriously feared for my life last night and do not want to experience this again. for you die hards all i can say is have fuuuuuuun and be careful.
AbSyNtHeTiCs; please note in your research that i have been pulled over on routine traffic stop (my friend was driving and speeding) and searched. The cop found our jwh-018 blend and was not bothered by it at all. He said he knew about it and it’s legal as of now.
Heya guys, this seems to be the most posted thread on this subject that I have seen. I have been using my own spice blend for about a week now. I found out about jwh 018 through a local newspaper, that pretty much taught me how to make it. I ordered a premixed herbal insense and 2g of Jwh 018. this 1st batch i made I have been smoking 2 to 3 times a day for 7 days. No issues so far, however I do kinda wig out that I am smoking a chemical. As far as i have read (with about 2 months of daily research) there has been both positive (claims of helping w/ prostate, and not toxicity reports) and negative reports (1000x worse than cigarettes, seziures), but when the dice are on the table no one really knows anything. Its been very hard to find citable research (if anyone has some pls let me know), but both sides of the fence are filled w/ ppl that say they are right. I dont know which side i am on, like i said its been just a week, but the lack of supply in my location makes it a hell of a lot safe/ legaler (is that a word?). When it gets down to it, if the Marijuana Prohibition would end/ wound never have been put in place, I highly doubt that this drug would have been invented, or we’d be having this discussion now. Most of what has been posted have been opinions, Im looking for facts. Can anyone help me out?
10 days now and life is up and down for SWIM (someone who isn’t me). Horrible. Every morning exactly as waking up anxiety flows in quickly. This anxiety subsides but it is difficult to control. Through out the day panic comes and goes. Mainly in the morning. As the afternoon comes around the individual sometimes feels entirely as if back to ‘normal’ this feeling can last all the way until waking up again the next morning. This in itself is discouraging to SWIM and very depressing. However, this is still much better than the first 6 days. There is some hope of SWIM regaining a normal life again.
The entire first 6 days every moment of life was in a partial daze. Eyesight was not exactly shakey, seems as if the eyes don’t want to focus and lock onto one object, rater dart around the area where they are trying to focus. It is a hard symptom for SWIM to describe. Now on day 10 this is not always happening to SWIM.
SWIM was VERY aware of his heart rate during the first 6 days. SWIM measures his blood pressure and heart rate frequently now. Blood pressure and heart rate are usually increased during the episodes of panic. Much less so now. Now during panic swim feels slight tightness near his heart/chest, not extreme racing heart rate as before, SWIM thinks this is an improvement but sill slightly worrysome (maybe possible trauma from all of this). When SWIM feels ‘normal’ there is no chest tightness virtually at all. Overall now blood pressure and heart rate readings are fairly consistent with ‘normal’ which is good.
Balance seems to be off. Almost as if on a boat in very, very calm water. This adds to the panic and the developing depression because it is hard to regain composure and focus on normal aspects of life when the panic and balance issues are at work. When feeling ‘normal’ during phases of the day this is not present.
Every day SWIM wishes he never found these products. SWIM reads of people taking 2 weeks, 1 month, 2 months, 5 months, 1 year to be back to ‘normal’. SWIM agonizes over this amount of time and is hoping for a fast recovery.
These symptoms have greatly impacted SWIM’s ability to work; this has added extra panic of losing SWIM’s job.
SWIM used to drink before this incident (has not sense) SWIM used to use marijuana in the past (at least 2 years ago). SWIM has never had any mental issues or been on any medications through out all of life.
SWIM worries he will never be fully back to normal, he hopes that sharing his story and possible recovery will help SWIM to find others like him and more answers while also helping others that may be suffering from the same problems and searching out more information.
SWIM asks that if more individuals can post their bad experiences and how they began to return to normal it is appreciated greatly.
SWIM would like to stress to others, this is no joke. This happend from the smoking blends, very little ammounts, and not from the pure chemical. SWIM understands many HAVE NOT been hurt from these products. SWIM HAS. Please take this story to heart.
I’m getting a little tired of these seemingly fake “horror stories”.
This ^ seems pre-written to me to achieve a different goal, i.e. **cking with people.
is it not possible he some how soaked his receptors and is experiencing aftershocks? or is it in his psyche and he is over-thinking it or dwelling on the panic of the incident? I know the medical bills and the authorities pressure after going to ER would be enough to traumatize ones mental status
Ben–
SWIM hopes that you never experience something like this EVER. This horror story is SWIM’s life!
It may be possible that it is lingering effects or some type of stress associated with the first panic. Whatever the cause, SWIM hopes it goes away eventually and can return to normal. SWIM would not wish this on anyone.
SWIM has never had such stress, anxiety, and depression in his entire life up until this point coupled with the other symptoms which now seem to go and come.
SWIM can only advise to be careful, SWIM’s personal experience is terrible. Everyone is different. If there was not others which posted similar experiences on the internet SWIM would be losing his mind right now!
Oneday–
How did swim take it? Smoking? Eating?
How much did swim take? mg wise
How long did Swim use? Was Swim a chronic mj smoker?
Swim drank b4? how much?
Most important, was SWIM taking it straight as a poweder? if so what color was the powder? or did Swim get get it as a pkg of insense?
–To all other posters
Does anyone have any documented FACTS, not opinions not expiriences. Im looking for any clinical documentented citable information, any links sites books, anything is helpful.
exactly, provide some real information…you probably felt your heart beating to hard because you become more aware of your heart on jwh. this probably led to the panic attack am i right?
I searched for a while online and only came across a few somewhat sketchy looking toxicology reports. Nothing really solid, documented, or citable though. Which really sucks because yes we would all love a group of scientists to get together perform a bunch of thorough and extensive testing on these Spice’s so we know just what exactly could happen to us. Until that happens though all we have to go off of is our own personal experiences and opinions (mainly experiences). Which as of lately I am not sure where everyone lives who has been having these terrifying sounding episodes of panic attacks etc. I wonder if it is just happening in certain areas of the world perhaps all using the same distributor? or if there is any relation between these cases besides the main ingredient JWH-018. Like perhaps there is another additive being used, or the solvent being used to dissolve the JWH is maybe causing these “attacks” ? I am still going strong on about 3 months now of smoking this stuff and I have had no such attacks. I have smoked anything from a few puffs a day to multiple bowls/blunts in a day and no attacks for me. Of course that is just my own experience and that’s why this blog is here. To share our experiences and what we “think” we know.
wow ! thought i’d pop back to see what was happening in this post , seem to be a few more “bad trips”.
i’m totally “normal’ now . took 6 months though of feeling a bit better every day . the experiences people have experienced are spot on to mine . from the research i did after the “event” it sounds to me we’ve all experienced full blown panic attacks . people use the term for anxiety sometimes , a panic attack is very different though , very intense feelings of doom and physical symtoms of chest pain racing heart fainting , basically feeling your going to die ! on par with the worst experience of my life anyway.
apparently its common after you have a panic attack for it to trigger an anxiety disorder ‚from which it can take some time to recover . the first week or two i thought i had gone mad ‚i have to say .
i never felt my body was under performing ‚i do some high intensity sport ‚so i presume the effect was mental harm and not physical.
i’ve dabbled in most drugs in my life and was a regular smoker, i know what a bad trip is ‚times that by 10 and stick it in your pipe and smoke it !
weed was the love of my life , my harmless friend , i’ve not dared spark one up since , think my mind just gave me a warning ‚i’m heeding it ! stick to the real thing something not right with this stuff!
indeed, many are experiencing panic attacks because they cannot quite cope with the fact that their heart is a tiny simple organ capable of stopping at any moment. death looms upon us every day. we are guilty we are sinners it’s all true.
understand you are “tripping” on jwh just like other psychadelic drugs and yes this includes Mary Jane. Mary Jane just has so much pain killer in it that it is the perfect little smoke lol.
I have considered taking a break from JWH because too much of ANYTHING is a bad thing…
seems this forum is divided ‚some who have experienced something so scary that they feel the need to warn others (myself for one,first time i’ve used forums like this) and others who refuse to believe that something that is giving them pleasure could also dish out so much pain.
i honestly don’t want anyone to go through the mental shock it gave me , be careful , whats wrong with weed anyway, same price ?
nothing is wrong w/ weed. JWH is WAY cheaper, but the problem i find is availabilty. The internet is always open, but my town is always dry.…. I’d smoke weed anyday, but most of the time, its not an option.
Stumbled on this thread, thought id pitch in some advice. Alcohol, marijuana, LSD or basically any psychoactive can bring out anxiety, sleep problems etc — where they most likely already exist latently. The mind is a delicate thing, often poorly understood by its user…
If you experience problems, cease all drug usage. If you think you may have a pre-existing issue, dont start.
Here is some advice for people struggling for control of their mind: Dialetic Therapy (DBT) and mindfulness. (Both are used in the mental health industry). These are based on eastern practices like meditation. You see most people dont realise they have a break on their thoughts (STOP! — mindfulness), or a capacity for thought regection/checking (No thats not right, this is! — DBT). With practice in both these techniques, anxiety even delusion and other problems can be avoided. The simplist technique is simply to _do_ but not think. Try going for a walk, or doing the dishes, _without_ thinking or reflecting. It requires practice but is invaluable to the psychonaut, the mentally troubled, the spiritualist and basically everyone. But the stupid west is so backward about mind we treat these things with pills (Only in the last ten years or so have we realised mindfulness etc helps with mental problems, from bi-polar, to anxiety, to psychosis, to borderline personality. In years to come, hopefully these illnesses will have fully non-drug, cause based therapies, rather than drug, symptom based treatments)
Ive seen many things blamed for peoples mental problems, from upbringing, genes, brain chemical levels (by mainstream medicine, with _no_ evidence for the theory no less!), drugs. None of that is causally proven, so even if true, is pure conjecture. The brain is simply not that well understood, on a physical level. And none of that matters!!! At the end of the day, its your thought process that will damn or save you, right? Focus on what matters in such trying times — your mental balance (Ie if you have troubles, give some basic mindfulness and DBT a go. You dont have to chant or sit crosslegged, just be more aware of any crap that comes in your head, and try to think less)
You might also consider a very mild relaxant, like chamomile tea, plenty of excercise, some social contact and good food…
Also, in what I guess is now a side note, initial toxicology on JWH indicates no organ damage or toxicity– might help some of you hypercondriacs.…
another horror story,dont doubt,doubters
i now have to take etifoxin and prazepam ‚me who hate pills
cause it make one month my heart do a race all day long,and one month ive the feeling to be never truly awaken with vertigo,very scary
particulary thanks to “herb” and “ice gold resin“
i just feel “good” when im lying on a bed or instead when i do a physical effort and meet new(interesting) peoples but im easily tired
yes im a chronic little hypocondriac
yes my life is shit
yes ive smoked weed for 12 years before(but never try other drugs)
but i have never experienced panic attacks like that and the scarying “residual“state where i am now
i hope i will recover and not become a pills addict
herbal blends are not miracle for sure
i try them all from spice silver to the evil ice gold
weed is milk in comparison
The people with “horror stories” should frankly not do drugs periodz.
I smoke serenity everyday and I’m fine. Some people just can’t fuckin handle it and that’s that
Thanks for the actual info those of you that provided it
I’m new to the designer drug seen…and have smoked weed for 10 years…I tried this stuff had panic attacks, pains in my left shoulder, bad mood changes and now having kidney problems…back and stomach pain..has anyone experienced anything like this
I’ve been smoking on and off for about 30 years and just tried some of the blends on the internets for the past month. I have had no ill effects at all. I have one of those little cigarette one hitters that I use, I’d never think of smoking this in a blunt or anything bigger than what I already have.
For me these blends work out better than getting the real deal. Having two kids and a wife doesn’t merit me a lot of time to chase the real deal down. I just don’t have the time to do that and just don’t want to put myself in situations like that either. Plus my office also has DTs. So in my book this is a good alternative.
Use it in moderation. If you’ve never tried the blends before do so in small quantities so you can learn how it will hit you.
lou eason
Yes there are many stories of people having bad reactions on these spices. As for me personally i have had pretty much all of your symptoms except for the kidney problems.. There are also many people on here who have had no problems at all so I believe it affects every person differently.. i stop smoking this crap three months ago but I am still having the side effects from it.. There are getting easier but still there. Hope this helps
i have been smoking serenity now for about a solid yeah, i go through 2g a week (casual smoker) but due to it being costly (and i being a student) i decided to make my own.
for the dry herb i decided i wanted to try2 different herbs and decided to make 2 batches, i waned herbs that tasted and smelled good, and also something smooth burning, i decided to go with mullein and damania.
the recipe i went by recommended 1g of jwh to 75g of herb, that was the supposed right mix, my buddy an i wanting something a lil more potent decided to go with 60g. so 2 batches of 30g herbs with 1/2g jwh each.
i dont recommen being high when u do this cause we fucked it up pretty badly. we thouht the lil pocket scale we purchased weighed in pounds when it was actually ounces, so instead of weighing out 30g we actually only weighed out 3g…(“damn dude, for some reason i thought it woud be more then this, oh well…”) we did our research, found the 100% pure acetone, it was in the paint section at walmart, check the MSDS sheets for it, didnt find any denetonium benzoate (u dont want it, the most bitter substance)…long story short, we ended up naming it Forbidden fruit, u cant smoke more then 1 hit without tripping hardcore, the other day we took 2 hits and went into barnes and noble lookin for some art books and we ended up getting lost inside for bout half hour, finaly decided to sit on the floor and act like we were reading…
the 2nd batch we perfected and ended up perfect, all my friends love it, i love it, and it gets the job done just fine
if anyone wants the perfected recipe, just lemme know, but whatever u do, STAY THE FUCK AWAY FROM THE FORBIDDEN FRUIT!
no really, u can only take one hit
Well Florida has a real problem along with a few other states and now we have Charlie Crist proposing a ban on all spice in Florida. Not only that but we have HB187 that will put most head shops out of business. Im asking for all of your help and contact Charlie Crist and make him stop this ban on spice. This is the only job ive been able to get in 2 years and now its on the verge of becoming illegal.
Please help me keep this stuff legal.
Charlie Crist
Phone: 850−488−7146
Fax: 850−487−0801
Mailing Address:
Office of the Governor
The Capitol
Tallahassee, FL 32399 – 0001
States that have proposed bills to make spice illegal
Illinois
Missouri
Kansas currently illegal
Florida
Georgia
Louisiana
Ohio
Michigan
New York
Mississippi
Kentucky
Alabama
Help fight to keep this stuff legal. Its been shown to be way safer than prescription drugs and is employing many people including myself. I do not want to lose another job.
One of the big problems we have is that these products are unregulated and you do not know whats in it when you buy it. Anyone can slap a serenity sticker on a container or produce packages with that name and you would never know. Ive tried many different blends and I can tell you they all differ in some way. Someone can be making this in the basement of their home for all you know. Be sure you know where it comes from and whats in it. Some plant sources are harmful so be aware.
Personally I had a panic attack because i tried to smoke way way too much but all it was is my reaction to the feeling it gave me and nothing more. I calmed myself told myself it was all in my head and the bad feeling went away in a few minutes. Now that ive experienced the hype I know that its nothing more that a sub conscience reaction that I can easily overcome no matter how high I get. To me it was like a bad acid trip. Its all up to you to make that experience pleasant and thats what I experienced.
Ive been doing drugs for a long time and know what to expect so it was no surprise that I hasd a panic attack. It started with my breathing. It made my chest numb and I reacted to that experience. Once I got back to whats real and whats not I was perfectly fine enjoying my high as usual. I had a pain in my lung but I discovered that was all in my head too. Maybe there are real problems with this stuff, but I have to say that for me it was all mental and not physical. It seemed like it was physical but I got over it real quick and I do not experience it anymore.
Maybe from the many years of doing drugs I can determine reality from fiction I dont know, But at least be ready and responsible with any thing you ingest.
Enjoy and be safe
Somethings that need to be said. A LOT of people are describing the same experiences who ARENT on jwc-018 and its due to astrological features. Mercury retrograde in taurus for example. If you look at the dates of some posts it falls in the april 17-may 11th period. Things arent over till the 28th of may. I think it was a plot to advertise spice on tv on april 13th to get people on jwc-018 for this period which exacerbated the symtoms. Look up cannabis indica (cannabis i.) in the homeopathic pages and books and go “woah”. Get checked by a chinese medicine doctor. Get on some herbs. Antidotes for marijuana intoxication are mung beans and also pidgeon peas. The latter is better. Do *not* mix it orally and smoke. I think this leads to ISOPATHY which drives a condition deeper. Flower remedys of agrimony for fear and rescue remedy. Ironically, Hemp will also detoxify. Drink hemp seed milk and eat bars with hemp. When I was 5 I ate 5 – 6 hash brownies by accident, I know what intoxication is and its not fun.
^ HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
–_–
Concerned, do you think isopathy can be countered with diametrical herbal synergistics? For example I always have sexual trouble when Mercury is retrograde in taurus, more specifically I cannot maintain erection. But I find consecration of the biomass with diametresis can help this. Smoking mung bean infused with jwc-018 is recombinative, nullifies fear, elevates remedy. Impotence is neutralized and vigorous erection is maintained throughout coitus and beyond. Very much in line with known tenets of homeopathy, for whereas jwc-018 in isolation can induce neuronal retrograde, synergized with mung bean produces a counter-retrograde when smoked that is a palliative and detox multiplier.
Food for thought.
@ Concerned
What is this “jwc” business? If you mean JWH, be aware that it’s not exactly THC. The treatment sounds tasty– mung beans and pidgeon peas– well, maybe with bacon. And if I had a farm, seems to me it’d take a whole field in order to grow enough hemp seeds to even make a glass of hemp seed milk. Sounds expensive! Plus, if someone’s had too much JWH-018, I can’t imagine going through all the effort of getting the poor soul to choke down mung beans and pidgeon peas, even if I had the luxury of a glass of hemp seed milk to offer them, to wash it down with. Egads, man! This is serious stuff. Have you tried it?
@People @ home:
If you find yourself in a state of having taken too much jwh-XXX, the first logical thing to do is to not take any more jwh, jwc, or any other chemicals, for the time being.
Next, it’s important to remember: stay relaxed, and do not panic. There’s no need to panic. The effects don’t last that long. You will notice them slowly subside. With the power of your spirit, and the right of your self to exist comfortably in this place and time, you will be able to (and remember to!) breath slowly, calmly. You will smile and have a warm and wonderful feeling of confidence as a result. Next, you should try to dilute whatever you’ve ingested. If you’re nauseous, start lightly. Clear liquids is the key, especially at first, then work your way up to solid food as you’re able. But diluting is good. “Comfort food” rocks, but don’t eat too much or it’ll counteract the “comfort.” Rest. Breathe. It’ll be over. If you have someone near who you trust, all the better. Actually, you should not be cooking if you’ve had too much JWH. It really isn’t safe to be around dangerous temperatures if you are extremely high. But you should dilute the jwh as you can.
If you take more than the normal dose and/or you feel like you need medical help, call 911.
I have personally taken a huge oral dose of 99.7 – 99.8% jwh-018. It was my first time, a memory I can now laugh about. At the time, I was nervous, and was trying to be somewhat conservative, have just a tiny taste, so I would not end up “panicking, from taking even a little bit too much.” I’d spent dozens of hours reading all that I could about the jwh class of chems, read the whole range of wonderful to nightmarish reports. With my new little scale I attempted to measure between 3 and 4 mg. I figured 5 would be OK, if it happened to end up that way, you know, instead of having to go through all the trouble of having to put some back into the little bag and all. Anyway, I dropped a tiny aluminum foil cup onto the scale, then tared it to 0.000g. I carefully pressed the fragile cup, and the numbers went up; when I let go, the numbers went back to 0.000g. Beauty! I took a tiny penknife blade, carefully used its tip to obtain “half of a rice grain” in volume of the jwh, transferred it into the tiny foil cup, and voila! The readout said 0.000g. Hmm. I tested it by gently pressing the blade onto the little cup again until it showed around 0.040g, then I lifted the blade and it went back to 0.000g. For some strange reason, it got me to thinking that what I’d put in the cup already was less than half a mg. [It still, to this day, seems quasi-logical] So I put more jwh into the cup. Still nothing but zeroes. I added more. Oh, finally! The readout said something new! 0.012g. Cool. Ah. There was something strange… but… hey, I had numbers now. One point two mg, I thought, . I had only wanted to try a small amount the first time, naturally, just to get a feel for it. Another scoop. 0.019g. Another. 0.025. Wow. Seemed like a lot more volume than what I’d read it would be. Two and a half mg, huh? No. No way. I knew I could handle more than that. I’ve taken shaman-level, and then some, doses of various “magic” mushrooms, PCP twice, LSD (one time over 100 hits at once) and other drugs, the worst ever being alcohol. Two and a half mg of jwh-018? Ha! Child’s play! Another scoop went into the cup, and another. “Jeez, Wally, that’s a lot of powder in there.” “Gosh, leave me alone, squirt.” Yep, I decided that 3.5 mg was small enough in weight, yet strangely it looked bigger than what I was led to believe. I had a feeling I should stick with what I had and not add any more. I tested it it by pressing lightly and letting go. It read 0.037g. Close enough, I thought, and dumped the powder straight into my open and upturned mouth. It was slightly tan/off-white powder and small crystals, tasteless. It didn’t dissolve in my saliva, as was expected, so I tried a small amount of a name-brand peanut butter and found that it helped more or less dissolve. Swallowed it all down with tapwater, rinsed and swallowed several times afterwards, then waited, all the while telling myself that everything would be OK, that I am not one to panic even if I do take a huge amount of something strong. Yeah, this was going to be a piece of cake. I waited about a half hour and then realised that I had taken thirty five mg… no thirty-seven mg! Not three and a half… no… 35mg! I felt like an idiot, then I started to panic about my impending panic attack I would surely have because I took too much jwh, and there was no turning back now, and– oh– that’s right. I was not going to panic, but was determined to enjoy the experience, instead.
And I did. When a touch of anxiety or panic crept up, I saw it for what it was, and it stopped. Overall, it was like eating a large quantity of excellent bud, without the yummy taste and spectrum of other chemicals alongside THC that make real bud a better (IMHO) overall experience than JWH. Pounding heart, shortness of breath, paranoia? No way. I was not even close to that. The scariest thing of all was being afraid of the panic attacks I thought I would surely have. It’s nonsense. Apparently JWH-class chems, like great buds, help provide experiences that are, in the end, what I choose to make of them. It was fun, actually, and after three or four hours I felt secure that the most intense part was over. Tastes were affected. I noticed moments of different flavors, while not even eating– like for a few seconds I tasted intense strawberry and it was gone, then I tasted bleu cheese and it was gone. It seemed kind of funny at the time, so I started imagining different flavors– prime rib, and it’s gone, cherimoya, and it’s gone. It was very much like the pot feeling except for an odd “opposite” sort of sense that is hard to describe, but I guess it’s like I got quick mental flashes of the opposites of things. I felt quite baked, anyway. I ate a lot, then went to bed. The next day I awoke feeling groggy and half stoned. I hadn’t felt that way in decades. The stuff was great at relieving my back pain, too, but I’d taken quite a lot of it. I ended up being respectful of, but definitely not afraid of, the JWH class of chems. It’s like super high-grade bud that’s missing… something. I have learned over a two-week period how to eye the doses closely enough. Yep, I’m more conservative now, for sure, taking about 12mg PO. It takes nearly 3 hours to really start hitting, and even then it seems pretty mild. I tried one of those glass pipes for vaping it, but the powder turned to liquid and started avoiding the flame. I had to chase the little drops all around the glass sphere. It didn’t ever really seem to burn, so I retired the stupid glass pipe.
I’m not seeing myself going to the ER for taking even 50mg. 35mg was pretty fun, once I remembered my strength. It wasn’t frightening or feel life-threatening at all. It was not as powerful or encompassing as I had feared.
i too have had similiar trips smoking my “forbidden fruit” which is composed of 500mg bonded to only 3g of herb, which i keep in a special lil baggy
i think the the diff between jwh and THC is u can definitly focus in more on ur body physically and how everything works inside, i have caught myself having to make myself breath, cause if i didnt, if i stopped thinking about it i would stop breathing, i found i could control my pulse, and somehow my blood pressure
my gf dosnt touch it nor anything else of the sort, but can def tell the difference in sex, its helps me with stress, pain, and depression, it sucks the state i live it banned it, legalize it, tax it, control it, and u have a win win situation, as mentioned by several people above, u dont just rush into any expirement or new drug, learn about it, the safety and precautions, respect it, embrace the euphoria try a lil at a time till u reach the point u wanna be at, i smoke it everday, i know one bowl gets the job done but i still smoke it slowly and take pauses in between hits, u can never be too safe and remember, do ALL things in moderation
alanh79:
thank you for that amazing post.
To: YOU ARE ALL SOO FUCKEN WRONG. Most of us have educated ourselves to the dangers of JWH-18. In it’s pure form it is very concentrated and it only takes a few crystals to get the job done. Your husband was just careless and greedy. Don’t call us wrong for that one. If you take too much of this stuff paranoia will destroy ya.
I was a big stoner, for a long time. I’m so old, I fart dust. I remember when you could order many RC’s that are now classified thru the mail and put it on your credit card. I have been following the JWH family for a while, and with the recent explosion in popularity decided to give it a try. Once a Psycho-Naut, always an explorer..
I got a sample of black Mamba, and thinking it was bunk, took a big olé oney. Not knowing the JWH time frame, I took another. T+15 minutes, i started feeling the buzz. T+20, I was stoned, I mean STONED. Standing in the garage like I had smoked a hit of the Kush kief. Wobbly balance (like LSD without visuals), floaters worse than usual. I think that my body was getting acclimated to the JWH. Went back to the store later, purchased 1g, had nothing but favorable experience with both. Tried a different brand, same distributor, and the experience was different. Without experiencing all of the JWH family, and knowing which way the receptors react I honestly cannot tell you which it was. Some sites state “will not ship to KS, KY” are probably jwh-018. THE PROBLEM IS: without labeling clarity, or in the case of ebay/internet purchase, full disclosure of what the ratio:dosage is per Gram, you don’t know which JWH you are getting, or how much. I have spent a lot of time researching this, and have found that some blends sell at 15mg/g, others at 22mg/g, and a few that claim up to 32mg/g. THE PROBLEM IS: no one is offering analysis of the compounds, and are basing the amounts on math, not chemical composition. Another factor: some of the blends are using different herbal bases, that in themselves have effects that you may not be accustomed to. RECOMMENDATIONS: start small and be patient. Be prepared to go on a journey… AS WITH ANY SUBSTANCE»> educate yourself before using, or making any decisions about dosage. If your blend contains damiana, go to a local hippie foods store, buy some damiana and experience it by itself, first so you can discern any differences when using a blend. If your blend contains mullein, Mallow leaf, hops or anything you don’t know, get some and try it solo. I personally have taken to making my own blend: 20mg. of the –018, 40 mg. of the –073, 10 mg. of the c,p,… ground or sifted… dissolved into 50-100ml. acetone, (WITHOUT denetonium benzoate): I make the “blend” with Damiana, Ma-Huang, Kinick Kinick, tobacco, mint leaf, cinnamon, and vanilla(put into acetate stage) to equal 14-28g depending on mood, and amounts on hand. Mix well, DO NOT LET SIT FOR MORE THAN 5+/- minutes, no smoking or open flame!!! TWO WAYS FROM HERE: 1. Pour wet mix into shallow large glass (pyrex lasagna pan) and let evaporate:
or:
2: pour wet mix onto stainless steel screen over a glass plate, let evaporate.
Either way, scrape residue on glass and add to blend when packaging in airtight container.
BE CAREFUL.
BE RESPECTFUL.
Do Not peer pressure anyone who does not want to try it into trying it. THAT SUCKS AND IT’S STUPID>
BE RESPONSIBLE..
Just ‘cuz it’s legal for now, doesn’t mean that it doesn’t impair your abilities, judgment, vision, rational thinking.
Know your rights, and if you are using these blends public, be prepared to get hassled, and don’t have any ILLEGAL things with you. ALSO – Dedicated a piece for using only BLENDS, don’t use your favorite weed pipe, It definitely has THC resin in it, and even though you don’t have weed on you, you can get a paraphernalia ticket for the pipe if it smells, or tests positive for THC.
HAVE FUN AND BE SAFE
PEACE»>